what happened in '64?

Discussion in 'Rifle Talk' started by markIVbigblock, May 19, 2004.

  1. markIVbigblock

    markIVbigblock Super Member

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    I have been looking at winchester model 70's online and have noticed many of them say PRE 64 in big bold letters in the title why does this matter? are model 70's made before '64 better?

    Aaron
     
  2. Randy_che

    Randy_che New Member

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    I'm no expert, but Winchester changed the design of their rifle in 64. This made a lot of folks unhappy, as the new design had some problems. Some say that the Winchester rifles have never recovered. My friend's father in law has a pre 64 Model 70 in 30-06. Saw him shoot a very nice group last year before deer hunting season. I'm sure that there are folks that know a LOT more about it than me, and a google search might turn up some better information.
     

  3. wwb

    wwb Super Member

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    In 1964, Winchester dropped the Model 12 shotgun and replaced it with the Model 1200, changed the design of the Model 70, changed the design of the Model 94, and implemented some "manufacturing efficiencies" on many of their other products.

    This all came about due to a management change the year before.
     
  4. markIVbigblock

    markIVbigblock Super Member

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    does anyone know what actual changes were made to the model 70 in '64?

    Aaron
     
  5. bbanbury

    bbanbury Super Member

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    Basically, they changed from a controlled round feed and claw extractor to a push feed "button" type extractor. In some ways they seemed to "copy" the Rem 700. Now they offer the orig. controlled feed claw extractor, controlled push feed, and a simple push feed.
     
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    They did quite a few other changes as well,like going to stamped parts instead of machined...using a lower grade wood and using pressed chekering instead of hand cut .Most of the actions were hand fitted with much higher expertise...hence tighter tolerances....since they were made on much older equipment...I was told they were phasing this style of production out do to the cost and time constaints on making the rifle...and also on their shotguns...seems like the bean counters were more interested in the bottom line then actully producing a great rifle. The pre-64's weren't the absolute best rifles...but were a great deal better than anything else on the market.


    Mac
     
  7. stoogots

    stoogots Active Member

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    Pre 64 mod.70's were hand made rather than stamped out and mass produced. An easy way to differentiate between pre and post mod 70's is the bolt. The bolt was hand forged and was smooth. Post 64 mod.70's have stamped bolts.
     
  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Model 70's made before 64 acually are "made better". And the price of the used guns reflects that. More hand parts, better fitting, etc.

    That does not mean that they are "better guns" than the new ones. The new model 70 action is probably stronger and better designed than the old one. But the rifles just are not as nice.
     
  9. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    i had always heard and if you go to the browning website, and dial the phone number listed, they say browning/winchester arms company or something like that, anyway, i had always heard that winchester was bought out by another company, i think they were bought by browning
     
  10. 8pointduck

    8pointduck Super Member

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    You are wrong to say the new guns are stronger!The pre... guns were tight and fit /finish was a whole lot better. To sum it up the pre 64's were smooth as glass and at the time could out shoot anything in its class
     
  11. Winchester70

    Winchester70 Member

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    Yes in 1964 they did drop the control fed action and the claw extractor. But they have these rifles with the crf and the claw extractor still today. As a matter of fact, i just picked up a Winchester Classic Stainless Model 70 in the classic 270 Winchester cartridge. By just cycling the action, you can feel how well built it is and how strong. No offense to Remington owners, but Winchester definitly wins on the action!
     
  12. CartridgeGuy

    CartridgeGuy Active Member

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    What I understand is that that when Browning acquired Winchester in 1992, they brought in alot of automated high-tech machining equipment that could hold the tolerances of the pre-64 models thus bringing back the quality required for the claw extraction, etc. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it was either 1992 or 1993 when the Super Grade became available which was basically a pre-64.
     
  13. 8pointduck

    8pointduck Super Member

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    Winchester , I agree with you that the Classic is superior to the 700, but you would have a tough time in the south convincing the rest that it is true
     
  14. Winchester70

    Winchester70 Member

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    Well anyone who knows something about rifles can tell you that winchester has a much better action. And i can admit that the 700s have a better out of the box accuracy most of the time. I thought alot of southerners were wichester 70 guys?
     
  15. Drop-Shot

    Drop-Shot Super Member

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    Hey wwb,you seem like the guy that would know this,how hard is it or is it possible to fix a hair line crack in a pre-64 win?Some one I know has one in 264 win mag,and I could most likely get it reasonable,but I'm a little scared of the hair-line crack.Drop-shot
     
  16. 8pointduck

    8pointduck Super Member

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    Winchester, Alot of the guys I know who just have 2 or 3 rifles prefer Remington and Browning. The ones Like me are more likely to have Winchesters in there arsonal.
     
  17. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    i figured it out, i know you were asking abou thte gun in itself, but they were bought by browning, then... fabrique nationale bought browning and winchester, the post 64's are great guns though