Where's the 264's?

Discussion in 'Rifle Talk' started by webbo, Mar 24, 2005.

  1. webbo

    webbo Guest

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    New guy here with a question. How come it is so hard for me to find 264 win mag ammo. I've been using my fathers 264 for deer hunting and have the oppurtunity to use my grandfathers old sako 264 if I'd like, which I would for sentimental reasons. Another question is why don't you see new 264s that much?
     
  2. wwb

    wwb Super Member

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    The .264 Win Mag was/is a great round - when it first came out, it had two "problems" (neither of them was a problem, but that didn't matter).

    First, it somehow acquired a reputation as a barrel burner - not true, but the gossip spread and stuck.

    Second, it was thought of as too "in-between". A .243 or a .257 Roberts was thought of as an antelope, varmint, & small deer cartridge, but you had to step up to at least a .270 to have a "real" deer cartridge. Never mind that it had more energy than a .270.....

    So, the .264 was struggling when the 7mm Rem Mag came along and finally killed it.
     

  3. pigeonhunter

    pigeonhunter Guest

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    It's real shame what happend to the .264. (It's a bitchin' cartridge)

    And as a side note, I've been looking for a lefty Model 70 in .264 for four years. (And I just can't find ANY!!!! :x :x :x )
     
  4. luv2safari

    luv2safari Moderator

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    Re: re: Where's the 264's?

    You never will, either... :idea: :(

    The 7mm Rem Mag kicked the 264's rear end, and Winchester's 6.5mm died with a whimper...too bad. It was a nice plains game caliber. :(
     
  5. pigeonhunter

    pigeonhunter Guest

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    Re: re: Where's the 264's?


    Yeah, I figured that out about 3 months ago.

    (I don't even wanna tell you guys how many hours I spent looking for one :oops: )
     
  6. luvtohunt.com

    luvtohunt.com Guest

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    Its funny what cartridges survive the test of time and which ones don't. I am curious to see which of the new Ultra mags, short mags, and super short mags, survives.

    Any guesses?
     
  7. wwb

    wwb Super Member

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    I dont really know which ones will survive and which ones will die, but I'll be there will be a lot of casualties. They don't really offer anything we don't already have, except they're "New and Improved"
     
  8. Drop-Shot

    Drop-Shot Super Member

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    For the same reason I won't buy a first out new vehicle,I won't buy the new stuff till it's been out for a few years.That don't mean they are bad,I just want other folks to work out the kinks and see how well they do.Drop-Shot
     
  9. Pat T

    Pat T Moderator

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    I think that if a person looked at the issue of cartridge selection on an objective basis, you almost would have to come to the conclusion that anyone could get by with just a .22 centerfire (say .22-250), the .30-06, and the .338 Win mag. I picked these for versatility in performance and availability. That really covers all the situations you find in the North American continent with proper bullet selection. Now, I know that there are screams of heresy from everyone who just had their favorite cartridge deleted, but I still think this is true. All of the rest of what's out there is just to generate rifle sales and the desire in people to have something "different" or "better". What happended to the .264s is a small-scale version of what I'm postulating. Realistically, there is only so much variation in performance that can be had by blowing out cartridge shoulders or stuffing hotter powder into a case for a given bullet diameter and weight. Look at the ballistic charts of the new wonder-boomers compared to the old standards they are competing against. In most cases, the difference is 100 fps per bullet weight. To my mind, none of what the gun manufactuers are doing makes sense to me. If you want me to buy a new rifle, then make one that looks better than an injection-molded POS from a Taiwan tinker-toy factory. And how about less than 3" groups at 100 yards with factory ammo? Or a trigger that you can actually set to break crisply at 3 lbs.(or less, if that's what you want)? Or a wooden stock that doesn't look like it was fashioned from a locust fence post? I still hunt the 700BDL in 30-06 my Dad gave me 30 years ago. The only - and I mean ONLY - rifle I've had the desire to buy since then is a Weatherby Mark V. I needed it like a hole in the head, but it met the criteria I just listed, and I bought one on Gunbroker.com. So that's my take on the firearms industry right now, feel free to flame away, this is just my opinion and I'm certainly not saying that if you disagree with me you're wrong, more power to you. I'm sure the gun mfgrs are glad there are more of you out there than there are of me. I think there will be many more cartridge gravemarkers beside the .264s when this is all said and done. Best wishes and good hunting, everyone!
     
  10. Drop-Shot

    Drop-Shot Super Member

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    Pat I appreciated the logical way you approached this delema,but some of us have wants instead of needs,I want a 243 for antelope,30/06 for muleys and 300 weatherby mag for elk,I don't need them,I have killed 15 elk in 38 years of hunting them and did it with a 30/06,I have had several dry seasons because of being picky.If we were only practicle then all I would need is a 30/06 and shoot 150 gr at antelope,165 gr for muleys and 180 gr for elk,but I guess I have become less than practicle and prefer different guns for different hunts,but you have the right Practicle thinking.The gun industry has made money on me and when I look in my gun safes I enjoy the wants,my wife would prefer your practicle needs over my wants.Drop-Shot
     
  11. Pat T

    Pat T Moderator

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    Thanks for the reply, Drop-Shot. Please don't think I was running down you're desires in firearms choices, that's not the case at all. It just frosts me when the gun makers keep cranking out iteration after iteration of cartridges in the same bore diameter to generate rifle sales, rather than producing truly top quality guns. I think others are starting to see this, as you see ads for Ed Brown custom rifles and Cooper rifles in the gun rags (I mean mags) now. I don't know what they are like, but I'm sure they are looking to fill the quality niche. Speaking of the gun mags, have you noticed the articles appearing in last month Shooting Times and Guns magazines that are trying to tone down the emphasis on the 1" groups at 100yds? I find this especially coincidental that those were the issues right after the 05 SHOT Show. Mayhaps the gun mfgrs had a confab with the writers and suggested that gee, maybe since these smoke-poles we're making really can't DO that, howsabout shutting up about the 1" groups at yards fercryinoutloud!? All I know is that if a guy plunks down a months worth of gross pay for a rifle and good scope, he ought to be able to expect it to shoot 1 1/2" with factory ammo, and not look like it was made by a kid in high school wood shop. In my mind, THAT'S what generates gun sales. The thread about the 264s and what eclipsed them just boiled all this up to the surface for me, hope I didn't make any enemies. Enjoy your guns Drop-Shot, may there be many more hunts for us all with our good rifles!
     
  12. Drop-Shot

    Drop-Shot Super Member

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    No enemys here Pat,and I agree that gun makers are making alot of money on new cartridge's but they have to sell alot of guns today to be here tomarrow.With all the firearms from all over the world pouring in to america,the american gunmakers are trying to keep up.If you would see the big production line some gunmakers have you would have to ask,how does every body here get paid?Gun sales.I don't know how they do it,I would go 4 or 5 years before buying a new gun,then I would buy 1 or 2 per year,thats not enough to keep the factorys open,or even pay the phone bills.They depend on mass salses and these new cartridges is another marketing tool,and I agree that these new cartridges will only do what the old standards will do.When a guy from Winchester was interviewed several years ago he said,all I want to do is make a living and drive a nice truck.That means gun salses, and alot of gun sales today and many tomarrows.I'm old and like the old cartridges but the gunmakers have to make a market nitch and these new ones are it.We however have the old cartridges around and will continue to use for years to come.Good night my friend.Drop-Shot